Posts by King Solomon

21

Was Jesus Christ A Schizophrenic, With Who's my Father Issues?

by frankiespeakin in

today if someone claims to be the son of god, we naturally think he has some type of mental problem, and in some cases like charley manson, jim jones, and other too numerous to give a list here,, they get a groups of followers which share the same delusion,sometimes bringing tragic results.. the governing body delusion of being the spokeman for jehovah, has also resulted in a big number deaths.. so what about jesus christ?

was he delusional?.

take a read of this:.

King Solomon

Cold Steel said:

I wouldn’t turn to the Jews for arguments against their Messiah, because it was prophesied that they would reject him. Jesus condemned many of them because of their disbelief.

D o you listen to what you're saying? Think about it for a minute:

- You say Jews MUST reject a Messiah claimant to fulfill that specific prophecy (which is NOT found in the original OT scripture: that's a Xian apolegetist interpretation used to justify Jesus' failure to fulfill other specific prophecies).

Here's the claimants:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_messianic_claimants

I'll play along here, for the sake of argument:

If the Jews must reject "the messiah", then how can he lead Jews to assume the Earthly throne and usher in the Messianic Age, and fulfill all the other prophecies? Some prophecy must fail.

I t must've been a good call for Jews to reject all those claimants (including Jesus), since, last time I checked, the Temple hasn't been rebuilt in Jerusalem, etc. No Jewish Messiah yet!

And let's assume for a minute that Jesus accepted the same twisted interpretations of Isaiah used by Xians to justify why the "true messiah" was rejected: why would Jesus be surprised by their rejection, or bother to condemn the Jewish rejecters to Hades? He'd KNOW they were simply doing their part in fulfilling prophecy, thus carrying out God's Will! His condemnation indicates he WASN'T the true messiah, as he'd instead point to their rejection as PROOF, as fulfillment of prophecy, and he'd manage to overcome their objections to assume the throne.

Flip-side is, if Jews actually accepted a given Messiah, they are NOT fulfilling Xian prophecy: hence that Messiah claimant cannot point to that particular fulfilled prophecy (if you accept the interpretation).

The Xian apologetic prophecy fails as being logically inconsistent, no matter how you cut it. They've created a catch-22, an irresolvable paradoxical interpretation.

494

Jesus wife fragment is a fake

by Christ Alone in

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/21/gospel-jesus-wife-forgery.

gospel of jesus's wife is fake, claims expertscholar says papyrus fragment believed to provide evidence that jesus was married is a modern forgery.

karen king from harvard university holds the papyrus fragment that has four words written in coptic, which are believed to prove jesus was married.

King Solomon

Uh oh: Jesus didn't practice what he preached:

http://jdstone.org/cr/files/turntheothercheek.html

“Turn the other cheek" was not practiced by Jesus himself

Question: Could Jesus (god incarnate) have hated anyone when he spoke words of forgiveness and non-resistance to wickedness? Did he not say, "Love your enemies" (Matthew 5:44, Luke 6:27), "Do not resist him that is wicked; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn to him the other also" (Matthew5:39) and, alternately, "To him that strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also" (Luke 6:29)?

Answer:
These verses are taken as representative of the extraordinary forgiveness taught and exercised by Jesus. However, the sublime dictum to "turn the other cheek" was not practiced by Jesus himself. According to the Gospels, Jesus preached turning the other cheek, loving one's neighbor and praying for them, and forgiving those who wrong you. When did Jesus manifest such behavior in his personal relationships, during his lifetime, for others to emulate? Was it:

his cursing of the Pharisees (Matthew 23),

his threat of violent retribution on cities that rejected his message (Matthew 11:20-24, Luke 10:13-15), or

his condemnation to death of Jews who would not accept him (Luke19:27)?

The fact of the matter is that he himself never turned the other cheek.Jesus never forgave anyone who rejected his claims. He responded to his opponents, not with passive resistance, but by answering criticism with criticism, reviling and threatening his adversaries (for example, Matthew 23).

It is clear from the gospels that Jesus never forgave anyone who wronged or criticized him. At best, he only forgave those who wronged others.Whenever an opportunity arose to personally forgive someone, he always declined. For example,

"he [Jesus] began to reproach the cities in which most of his miracles were done, because they did not repent. 'Woe to you,Chorazin ! Woe to you Bethsaida! . . . Nevertheless I say to you, it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon in the day of judgment, then for you. And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You shall descend to Hades; for if the miracles had occurred in Sodom which occurred in you, it would have remained to this day. Nevertheless I say to you that it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment,than for you'" (Matthew 11:20-24, Luke 10:13-15).

Instead of forgiving Judas for betraying him he said: "But woe to that man through whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been good for that man if he had not been born" (Matthew 26:24).

In John 18:22-23, we find that Jesus, when beaten by an officer, instead of offering quietly his other cheek argues with him: But having said these things, one of the officers standing by gave Jesus a slap, saying: "Is that the way you answer the high priest?" Jesus answered him: "If I have spoken wrongly, bear witness concerning the wrong; but if rightly, why do you hit me?"

For his part, Paul, the late follower of Jesus, did not submit meekly to the high priest Ananias' order that he be smitten on the mouth:

And the High Priest Ananias commanded those standing beside him to strike him on the mouth. Then Paul said to him:

"God is going to strike you, you whitewashed wall. And do you sit to judge me according to the Law, and in violation of the Law order me to be struck? (Acts 23:2-3)

Paul did not offer his cheek in compliance with Jesus' command. Instead, he swore at Ananias in direct contradiction of another of Jesus' alleged commandments: "Bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you" (Luke 6:28), and his own statement: "Bless those who persecute you; bless, and do not curse" (Romans 12:14).

494

Jesus wife fragment is a fake

by Christ Alone in

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/21/gospel-jesus-wife-forgery.

gospel of jesus's wife is fake, claims expertscholar says papyrus fragment believed to provide evidence that jesus was married is a modern forgery.

karen king from harvard university holds the papyrus fragment that has four words written in coptic, which are believed to prove jesus was married.

King Solomon

I put that disclaimer in, just for you Tammy. You're welcome... ;)

494

Jesus wife fragment is a fake

by Christ Alone in

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/21/gospel-jesus-wife-forgery.

gospel of jesus's wife is fake, claims expertscholar says papyrus fragment believed to provide evidence that jesus was married is a modern forgery.

karen king from harvard university holds the papyrus fragment that has four words written in coptic, which are believed to prove jesus was married.

King Solomon

Although, Jesus DID tell his disciples to sell their cloaks and BUY swords.

But not to actually USE them to injure or kill anyone: of course not! Swords just look really cool, and are handy to have as backscratchers, fly swatters, or to deal with muggers (which shouldn't be a problem, being that they had taken a vow of poverty to become penniless fishers of men).

The real reason is clear: Jesus needed someone (Peter) to lop off a soldier's ear at some point, so he could reattach it and reinforce his healing, loving nature! I know a plot device when I see one....

20

Was it all for nothing ? We can't we start over again ?

by raymond frantz in

jw
friends

i know 99% of the posts here are for exposing wt doctrines and fallacies ,but there was a time that we really believed that we had full bible understanting .i know now that this is the case ,but why can't we use that as a starting point rather than the end of the road ?

why can't we be more like the jews of john the baptist's day that acknoledged their errors and started over again by whiping the slater clean and getting baptised in expectation of the messiah's coming ?.

King Solomon

Probably why many modern-day Jews adopt secular humanist views: they know the flaws of the OT, but continue with Judaism moreso for a sense of cultural identity and social interactions, and out of tradition (and as JWs ask themselves, what else would they be?)

Most Jews are not willing to die for their religion (as the nutsy Gentile evangelists are willing to do, in a flawed understanding of blood transfusion).

67

I would love for you to know my Oompa.... (from one of his closest friends)

by Robert7 in

jw
friends

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King Solomon

Wes and Stacey, thanks for sharing your selves and family with Eric when the witnesses were unable/unwilling to do so.

You guys have great big hearts for being able to do that for him, and I suspect it probably helped you to see what real love is, and hopefully helped confirm the rightness of your own decision to separate.

85

I was HAPPY as a JW, how did I get here?

by MC RubberMallet in

some have figured out, but i am a poster that previously used another name.

but even then i did not give many details about myself.

i barely cracked 100 posts.. but i have never done a thread to explain why i am here.

King Solomon

I can say that all alcoholics are miserable despite any exterior apperaces to the contrary.Alcoholism is a self medication that is symptom of a deeper problem. We can't be happy with lingering deep problems, we can only smile and bear through life, but we WON'T be happy no matter what. To claim that there is ANY happiness in the JW organization is akin to saying it's ok in certain circumstances to be an alcholic. That's crazy and enabling the deeper problem.

Sab, you're showing extremist thinking, another symptom of JW upbringing (dualistic, binary, either/or).

Fact is, there are functional alcoholics who don't let it effect their lives, and continue to drink for decades without causing a problem (i.e. productive at work, relationships, etc). The risk is they can cross a boundary, but many seemingly don't. So who's to say it's wrong or bad? It's like the old "if a tree falls in the forest" question, a theoretical harm that never happens.

You operate under the burden of false assumptions you carry as truths (eg "We can't be happy with lingering deep problems, we can only smile and bear through life, but we WON'T be happy no matter what"), when happiness is often simply allowing YOURSELF to put it all aside.

Bottom line is, it's YOU holding yourself back, not anyone else. You have to give yourself permission to let it go, and move beyond.

Fact is, many here are holding themselves back, refusing to accept the responsbility of whatever demons they are struggling with. But in the end, that's ALL it is to the challenge: the individual taking responsibility of their own life, as they're the only one who can change their own life (and they ultimately bears the cost of that decision). That is TTALATT ("The Truth About Life After The Truth)

It's the same idea about seeing TTATT: you cannot live a JW's life for them, or find a magic combination of words that makes them all wake up and see it. Instead, it's a personal insight that one has to be receptive to, or it won't stick.

17

Do You Think"Any" Jehovah`s Witness Understands The Concept Of Cognitive Dissonance ? Are They Capable Of Comprehending The Meaning ?

by smiddy in

i would appreciate your thoughts on the matter , with examples demonstrating their ignorance of the concept.. smiddy.

King Solomon

Ahhh, it's just like 'newspeak' in Orwell's 1984: if a concept doesn't have a name, or if the name itself if forbidden, it's like the concept never existed or can be eliminated. That was what the protagonist of the novel was doing, helping the leaders to eliminate words from the lexicon so that the concept could be eliminated from existence.

85

I was HAPPY as a JW, how did I get here?

by MC RubberMallet in

some have figured out, but i am a poster that previously used another name.

but even then i did not give many details about myself.

i barely cracked 100 posts.. but i have never done a thread to explain why i am here.

King Solomon

I'd advise caution going forward, as there's a great risk of someone swooping in and accusing everyone here of being Watchtower apologists, LOL!

That's the problem with trying to demonize JWs as evil people: they simply aren't. My family aren't, and yours aren't, as are most of the JWs I've met are not, either. It just doesn't stick.

However, it IS an organization where dissent isn't allowed: eventually you have to decide as an individual whether you want to belong to the group or not. It's true that individuals can do pretty horrible things under the color of authority, but that's a hazard of being a human: as strong-minded as you may think of yourselves, you cannot predict what you are capable of, under different circumstances.

Now for me, my personality has never been that of a JOINER, someone who goes along with causes or groups (and I don't know if that was a reaction to going away from JWs, or just some part of my basic personality (I've always been strong-willed, hard-headed). I've subsequently joined other groups, but always felt like some part of me was always keeping a barrier up that prevented me from truely "joining", as if holding back).

NC said:

That's just silly. Our lives weren't 'wasted' so much as misdirected. We still experienced living, even in a tiny box. There is nothing wrong with acknowledging that.

I wouldn't even go that far: for some of us, it was a healthy phase to go thru, but not to get trapped inside. It's one step of a process of exploring spirituality to find an individual definition of what meaning to ascribe to our lives, but most JWs halt their search after being told there is nothing else out there (excdept volunteer magazine distributors): they think they've found all the answers!

In pharmacology, the old saying is that no substance is toxic at all doses, but instead "the dose makes the poison". Heck, people die from drinking too much water (it's called "water intoxication"), and theology is much the same. What is normal for one is not healthy for another...

21

Was Jesus Christ A Schizophrenic, With Who's my Father Issues?

by frankiespeakin in

today if someone claims to be the son of god, we naturally think he has some type of mental problem, and in some cases like charley manson, jim jones, and other too numerous to give a list here,, they get a groups of followers which share the same delusion,sometimes bringing tragic results.. the governing body delusion of being the spokeman for jehovah, has also resulted in a big number deaths.. so what about jesus christ?

was he delusional?.

take a read of this:.

King Solomon

I dare say Jesus was not in an unusual situation: he was a bright Jewish boy who looked to please his parents, and was raised in a culture where young Jewish males wanted to please their Moms by growing up to be not just a Jewish doctor or successful lawyer (as today), but to be a Jewish messiah, if not THE Messiah. It sounds like an environment actually encouraging the formation of Messiah complexes (plus a massive persecution complex, which certainly real persecution can do!). The entire Jewish community knew of the significance of the messianic hope, and it certainly must've given him some celebrity within the downtrodden community.

He didn't fulfill many of the prophetic criteria, and some rejected him rightly due to not meeting the well-known qualifications laid out in the OT. There were many other wanna-be Jewish messiahs, but none completed the prophecies (eg rebuilding the 3rd temple in Jerusalem).

Here's the explanation of why Jews rejected Jesus in his day, and are still awaiting the messiah.

http://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/jewsandjesus/